Thomas Ford - User need, user need, user need

Background: Thomas (Arend) Ford is a legendary product builder and leader at some of the industry's top companies, including IBM, SAP, J&J, Google, Twitter, Airbnb, and Facebook. We connected through Fresco’s investment in his previous company (unfortunately, we did not have the opportunity to work together at Airbnb, but like-minded people often find a way to meet!). We have kept in touch, discussing various aspects of product building and taste.

This is the first interview that delves deeply into his experiences and decision-making at key inflection points in crafting exceptional products.

Q1: How did you get into product management and choose it as a career?

A1: I started as a software engineer, deeply obsessed with computers. After reading Ray Kurzweil's "The Age of Intelligent Machines" from the nineties, I was stunned and wanted to learn everything about AI and robotics. This led me to computer science. While working as a software engineer, I realized that what truly drives me is the user. I love understanding how machines work and the capabilities of AI, but my real passion lies in building better products. This only works if you get close to your users and understand their unmet needs and desires.

The transition was challenging because, at the time, software engineering performance was measured by lines of code and code quality. I felt I was underperforming because I didn't fit the traditional mold. One day, my manager called me into his office, and I was sure I was going to be fired. Instead, he said, "I don't know what you're doing, but keep doing it because we've never been more successful as a team." That conversation validated my approach of talking to users to find direction. It’s not about building what they ask for but understanding what they truly need. That’s how I got into product management.

Q2: What is your go-to product that you use daily?

A2: For me, a product must pass the "toothbrush test" – something I use several times a day. That product is Google Maps. It might sound boring, but it has incredible utility, is easy to use, and integrates seamlessly into my routine. It helps me achieve my goals and caters to my needs, making it an essential part of my daily life. Maps may seem like a commodity, yet newer apps like Citymapper are driving significant innovation in the space, while Google Maps itself appears to have slowed down in this regard.

Another product I use daily is my Peloton. I know, it’s the quintessential Silicon Valley cliché, but I believe they have done an amazing job integrating software and hardware seamlessly, creating a highly engaging user experience. Peloton uses gamification in modest but effective ways and fosters a sense of community, even if you’re pedaling alone in a room going nowhere.

Q3: What is your definition of a product, and how do you measure its success?

A3:

• Product or Service: A solution for a user’s or business's unmet needs/desires. It can be any offering that satisfies a want or need.

• Effective Product Management: Involves understanding the product’s characteristics, lifecycle, and market dynamics to ensure it meets customer expectations and achieves business goals.

• Success: Meeting needs, exceeding expectations, delighting users, becoming a habit, and creating recurring value for the business.

• Measuring Success:

  • Define Clear Objectives: Establish specific, measurable goals for success.

  • Select Relevant Metrics: Align metrics with product objectives and lifecycle stage.

  • Continuous Monitoring: Regularly track and review metrics to identify trends, issues, and opportunities for improvement.

  • Holistic Approach: Combine quantitative and qualitative metrics for a comprehensive view of performance.

  • Iterate and Improve: Use data-driven insights to continuously enhance the product.

• Four Dimensions of Product Sense:

  • Identify user needs: Can you properly identify needs? Do you have the ability to segment your user base and understand their differences and fundamentally distinct needs?

  • Focus on value and impact: Are you focusing on value and impact? As you design your solution, are you just creating something, or are you truly focusing your product on the unmet needs you identified?

  • Design: Are you making intentional design choices? Do you create a cluttered, fully functional product that is a nightmare to navigate, or do you find ways to incorporate all this functionality with an intuitive user interface?

  • Adapt to new insights: How do you handle critique, new data, or constraints?

Q4: Can you describe your thought process and decision-making approach when developing a product?

A4:

• All starts with users, unmet needs “who is this for, why would they care” and market opportunity → hypothesis (validating rapidly, AB testing before building) → growth experiments → concept to delivery. The most exciting time is always whenever we create tangible, positive impact on many people’s lives.

• Bias: building the compounding effect of your understanding of the human behaviors. Bias might get you to hypothesis faster, but always check with real users and the most important thing is I am okay to be wrong.

Q5: What are the similarities and differences in product strategies and executions at different stages of a business?

A5:

Similarities:

• Customer Focus: Understanding and meeting customer needs.

• Market Research: Continuous analysis and competitor monitoring.

• Product Quality: Commitment to high-quality products.

• Feedback Loop: Ongoing customer feedback integration.

• Innovation: Constant drive to innovate and improve.

Differences:

• Flexibility:

  • Startup: High flexibility to pivot.

  • Scale-Up: Moderate flexibility with more structured processes.

  • Maturity: Less flexibility, focus on optimization.

• Resource Allocation:

  • Startup: Limited, focused on core features.

  • Scale-Up: Balanced between expansion and core product.

  • Maturity: Significant investment in efficiency and retention.

• Team Structure:

  • Startup: Small, cross-functional, agile.

  • Scale-Up: Growing, more specialized.

  • Maturity: Large, hierarchical, well-defined roles.

• Customer Interaction:

  • Startup: Close, direct feedback from early adopters.

  • Scale-Up: Expanding customer base, maintaining feedback loops.

  • Maturity: Emphasis on customer loyalty and retention.

Q6: What key metrics do you focus on when measuring and iterating on products?

A6:

• Engagement: DAU, MAU, Session Length, Retention Rate, Churn Rate, User Acquisition Rate.

• Usage: Feature Adoption, Task Completion Rate, Time to Value, User Journey Metrics.

• Satisfaction: NPS, CSAT, CES.

• Business: MRR, ARPU, CLTV, CAC, Gross Margin.

• Operational: Bug Reports, Deployment Frequency, Cycle Time.

• Marketing/Sales: Conversion Rate, Lead-to-Customer Rate, Acquisition Channels.

• Specific/Product-Type Metrics: Cart Abandonment (E-commerce), User Activation (SaaS).

• Qualitative: User Feedback, Usability Testing.

• Iteration: A/B Testing, Hypothesis Validation.

Q7: What key qualities do you look for in top-tier product hires?

A7: Someone with a super solid technical background who is obsessed with solving user problems and with an uncanny level of empathy with the user and their unmet needs and desires.

• Strategic Vision

  • Long-term thinking

  • Customer-centric focus

• Product Sense, Design Skills, User Empathy

  • Turning ambiguous problems into great products

  • Deep understanding of user needs and empathy

• Technical Skills & Cognitive Ability

  • Strong technical background

  • Comfortable working with engineers

• Analytical Skills

  • Structured and logical thinking

  • Well-organized execution

• Execution

  • Effective prioritization

  • Strong ability to get things done

• Leadership and Drive

  • Inspirational leadership

  • Building and supporting a team

  • Navigating tough times

• Communication

  • Effective communication at all levels

  • Clear articulation of complex concepts

  • Natural leadership and vision

• Innovation and Creativity

  • Pushing boundaries and questioning the established

  • Innovative mindset and risk management

• Operational Excellence

  • Execution and delivery

  • Resource management

• Continuous Learning and Improvement

  • Lifelong learner

  • Feedback-driven

• Ethical and Inclusive Leadership

  • Ethical standards

  • Diversity and inclusion

• Culture Fit

  • Alignment with company values

  • Kindness, respect, and inclusivity

• Role-Related Knowledge & Experience

  • Deep market and domain knowledge

  • Cross-functional collaboration

• Q7.1: What are some common mistakes you see people make when approaching product management?

  A7.1:

  • Not putting the user first -> solution in search of a problem

  • Mistaking user asks for actual needs

  • Confusing it with project / program management or general management (understand the value of PM)

  • Not being data-informed

  • Not defining success metrics

  • Focus on Growth first

Q8: How do you decide when to engage with and restart new problems?

A8: I like a complex challenge (learning). Building my professional profile

• SAP: enterprise (robust, reliable, scalable)

• Google: global scale, mobile, web

• Mozilla: open source

• Twitter: realtime

• Airbnb: marketplace

• Savvy: teaching & learning

• Facebook: scale, growth

• J&J: digital health, navigating compliance

• Astra Space: supply chain, hardware, science

• Slingshot Aerospace: working with classified data

• ROLI: empower and delight, connect, powerful new way to learn and create

  • Q8.1: How did you prioritize software design at SAP, and how did your approach evolve?

    A8.1: Initially, we focused on engineering-defined features, resulting in functional but poorly designed UIs. User rejection led to increased focus on user insights, data, and market insights to guide software development.

  • Q8.2: How did you approach launching global products at Google, Airbnb, and Twitter?

    A8.2: Understanding the international user, collaborating with local teams, and addressing technical challenges of country-specific versions were key. Teams were structured with a core product team (regular product team and product engineering team) at headquarters and local country teams.

  • Q8.3 How did you handle product strategies for different platforms at Mozilla and J&J?

    A8.3:

    • Timing: Phased rollouts and beta testing.

    • Target Platforms: Prioritized based on market research and user data.

    • Signals for Iteration: User feedback, usage and performance metrics, competitive analysis.

    • Team Setup: Dedicated platform teams with centralized coordination and cross-functional collaboration.

  • Q8.4: How does product leadership differ across digital, traditional, and disruptive industries?

    A8.4:

    Decision-Making:

    • Digital: Data-driven, agile, user-centric.

    • Traditional: Risk-averse, incremental, stakeholder-influenced.

    • Disruptive: Bold, visionary, flexible, experimental.

    Priorities:

    • Digital: Innovation, scalability, user acquisition, cross-functional collaboration.

    • Traditional: Quality, cost efficiency, customer loyalty, compliance.

    • Disruptive: Market disruption, rapid growth, vision alignment.

  • Q8.5: How do you manage resource allocation and compliance in regulated industries like health and space?

    A8.5:

    • Become a legal and compliance expect

    • Lots of reviews, work with lawyers and compliance experts

    • manage frustration, budget for slower than usual timelines

    • find wiggle room in product launches

Q9: How do you find clarity when facing uncertainty in product development?

A9: Going back to first principles, focusing on the user and their unmet needs, and aligning with market needs.

Q10: What advice do you have for creators considering big org roles versus launching their own ventures?

A10: Just do it! Build a well-rounded CV, and always keep learning. Here's a recommended reading list: Founder Insights.

!!!Bonus: some real stories

Your Hypothesis Might Be Wrong (from Facebook):

We noticed that Facebook users in Japan were not very active in groups and found that many felt judged due to Facebook's real-name policy. For example, Masato in Tokyo loved instant ramen but avoided joining related groups to avoid judgment. We hypothesized that anonymity would solve this, allowing users to choose any name and character. However, the experiment showed no change in behavior; users still felt judged because they were self-judged. This highlighted that our hypothesis, though based on user feedback, was incorrect. We learned that while biases can expedite hypothesis formation, real user validation is essential.

Global Context Matters (from Google):

In Japan, Google struggled against Yahoo, which was seen as a local company. Users perceived Google's minimalist design as "under construction" compared to Yahoo's content-rich portal. Additionally, Google Maps didn’t include crucial local features like subway stops and used scripts for learners instead of the Kanji preferred by adults. We adapted by adding local features and better localizing our products. Another early mistake was requiring SMS verification for Gmail signups, which was irrelevant in Japan where mobile email was prevalent. These missteps underscored the importance of understanding and adapting to local user contexts.

Turning Superfans into Team Members (from Airbnb):

Airbnb started without an international strategy, initially renting out airbeds in San Francisco and New York City. Unexpectedly, guests from 192 countries began using the platform. Without formal international offices, we relied on loyal fans in various countries who loved the concept and helped spread the word. These superfans, initially rewarded with stickers and t-shirts, later became official ambassadors and employees. For example, Eunji in Seoul started as a fan and eventually played a crucial role in expanding Airbnb in South Korea. This grassroots approach helped Airbnb grow globally, with a hub-and-spoke model of a central product team and local country teams adapting the product to regional needs.

Notes from Heyu:

The conversation is a blend of intense meta-structural thinking for approaching problems and vivid stories of implementing these ideas. We had two calls to go through the specific context of the big framework (Loved it!). The biggest takeaway is the importance of an iterative journey to understand and serve users, which is sometimes underestimated or overlooked in the tech business.

Whether we are practicing our craft in a startup or a large company, let’s not forget where we all started: with our users.